###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (phil sheridan)
Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 15:05:33 -0500
Subject: [CP] Re: Catalog and Joseph Pines Updates
Hi Folks:
We have made updates to both our catalog and Joseph Pines page. Note we
have several new offerings in the catalog. A special feature is a first
day cover of Cephalotus. The cover features both a stamp and beautiful
painting of Cephalotus. The first day cover was issued by the U.N.
We have added a link on Joseph Pines that has maps of the preserve. We
are planting more longleaf pine and are clearing more trails to several
outstanding sphagnum bogs. Mark your calendar to attend the Joseph
Pines Picnic on June 7 and see native Virginia Sarracenia flava in all
its glory!
Our web site is www.pitcherplant.org. Click on the catalog and Joseph
Pines links for details.
Sincerely,
Phil Sheridan
Director
Meadowview Biological
Research Station
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (phil sheridan)
Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 18:27:50 -0500
Subject: [CP] Re: S. purpurea var. montana
Hi Folks:
As Dave Evans pointed out we have S. purpurea montana. We have a
breeding program for this variety. We are raising seed from several
sites and have mature plants from one site. If you are interested in
obtaining this plant I would encourage you to order a seed cross from us
this spring. We bag the flowers prior to openning, hand pollinate under
controlled conditions, and deliver the seed to you in the fall. We
charge $25.00 per cross plus $10.00 for S&H. We gurantee our crosses.
Please contact me if you are interested in ordering a cross.
Sincerely,
Phil Sheridan
Director
Meadowview Biological
Research Station
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (phil sheridan)
Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 20:18:30 -0500
Subject: [CP] Re: Sarracenia pollination
>
Hi Chris:
We mentioned in several of our papers in the RESEARCH section at
www.pitcherplant.org (particularly the genetics papers and the AJB
inbredding paper) the techniques of Sarracenia pollination and materials
used. Plastic bags should not be used for Sarr. pollination for the
obvious reasons you mention. We use the same material for pollination
that we use for tenting our seedlings, namely drain sleeve fabric.
Please read the link under Sarraracenia propagation in PROPAGATION to
learn more about the material. The product is manufactured by Cariff
and can be found at Home Depot.
We used to use REMAY fabric for pollination but this involved cutting
and stapling the material. This was fairly labor intensive. With drain
sleeve faric you just cut the length you want and cover the flower, seal
with twist ties attached to bamboo pole. Very straightforward,
efficient, and allows air movement.
Sincerely,
Phil Sheridan
Director
Meadowview Biological
Research Station
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2003 22:02:07 -0700
> From: "J. Chris Coppick"
> To: Cp@omnisterra.com
> Subject: [CP] Love is in the air...
> Reply-To: Cp@omnisterra.com
>
> Well spring is here, and life is skittles and life is beer,
> and I have questions regarding these strange urges I have
> to transfer pollen between my Sarracenia blooms...
>
> Mr. Sheridan, you have often mentioned that Meadowview covers
> flowers to prevent, um, accidents, so to speak. My question is,
> what sort of bags do you use? The plastic ones I'm using do not
> provide for much ventilation, resulting in *lots* of humidity
> (even by Virginia standards) surrounding the flowers. I'm not
> sure having a soggy flower is a good thing, in this case.
> (I'm trying to take the high road here. Besides, there are so
> many jokes scattered about on the other road that I wouldn't
> know where to begin.)
>
> In addition to advances in botanical prophylactic technology, does
> anyone have any other tried and true Sarracenia pollination advice?
>
> Chris
>
>
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (phil sheridan)
Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 00:34:14 -0500
Subject: [CP] Re: Open house and Joseph Pines Picnic
Hi Folks:
Just a note to remind you that we are hosting an Open House here at Meadowview on Sat. 5/17 and the Joseph Pines Preserve Picnic on Sat. June 7. The Open House includes tours of our operations center, plant sales, and plant auctions. The Open House is designed to give you an idea of what we are doing and to raise money for our non-profit. We have several plant vendors that will be selling plants at
the Open House. If you are interested in setting up a booth please contact us.
We continue our plantings on the Joseph Pines Preserve and have a
greatly expanded trail system to all the sphagnum seeps. We will
complete the planting of all our native Virginia pitcher plants next
week and should have an outstanding display for you to see in June.
If you want to attend either the Picnic or Open House please respond by
the RSVP dates listed on our EVENTS link at www.pitcherplant.org.
Sincerely,
Phil Sheridan
Director
Meadowview Biological
Research Station
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (phil sheridan)
Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 20:27:42 -0500
Subject: [CP] Re: t-shirts
Hi Folks:
Just want to let you know we now have the Meadowview t-shirts back in
stock in all sizes. You can see a picture of the shirt on our catalog
at www.pitcherplant.org.
Sincerely,
Phil Sheridan
Director
Meadowview Biological
Research Station
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Cp@omnisterra.com)
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 21:35:02 EST
Subject: [CP] new list-server
--part1_113.1fda007a.2b980dd6_boundary
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Just sending a post to the list to make shore it is working on my end. I
believe I introduced myself a while ago when I first posted to the old list
but, from that point I have gained a lot of other plants to add to my grow
list. I'm interested in anything I can get my hands on to grow.
George McKay
--part1_113.1fda007a.2b980dd6_boundary
Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Just sending a post to the list to make shore it is wo=
rking on my end. I believe I introduced myself a while ago when I first post=
ed to the old list but, from that point I have gained a lot of other plants=20=
to add to my grow list. I'm interested in anything I can get my hands on to=20=
grow.
George McKay
--part1_113.1fda007a.2b980dd6_boundary--
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (James Aldridge)
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 20:50:39 -0600
Subject: [CP] Introduction
Hi. I've been interested in CPs since early college visits to Texas's Big
Thicket, where Utricularia, Drosera, and Sarracenia abound. My college work
is all in biology, and I am a science and computer science teacher at an
independent college preparatory school in Fort Worth, Texas, USA.
I run an 800 ft^2 greenhouse (out in the country just west of Fort Worth)
filled mostly with orchids, bromeliads, and CPs. I recently added a high
pressure RO system for processing my softened well water, and I feel I can
do better with both orchids and CPs now. I especially like Nepenthes spp.,
though I am getting rather fond of the larger Drosera (capensis, binata,
regia, etc.) spp. as well.
I also keep some terrestrial and epiphytic Utricularia, Mexican
Puinguicula, Sarracenia, Darlingtonia, and, of course, some VFTs.
Thanks for running the new list!
Jim
James Aldridge, PhD - Fort Worth, Texas, USA
jaldr@earthlink.net - www.JamesAldridge.us
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Lynda)
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 21:28:18 -0600
Subject: [CP] new list-server
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_0055_01C2E35E.23E730A0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
HI George,
Seems it's working fine. If you are interested in acquiring plants have =
you tried the trading post on the discussion forum at www.petflytrap.com =
? Frequently the folks there offer seeds or plants to interested =
parties.=20
Lynda Crane
----- Original Message -----=20
From: ZITMCKAY@aol.com=20
To: Cp@omnisterra.com=20
Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2003 8:35 PM
Subject: [CP] new list-server
Just sending a post to the list to make shore it is working on my end. =
I believe I introduced myself a while ago when I first posted to the old =
list but, from that point I have gained a lot of other plants to add to =
my grow list. I'm interested in anything I can get my hands on to grow.
George McKay=20
------=_NextPart_000_0055_01C2E35E.23E730A0
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
HI George,
Seems it's working fine. If you are interested =
in=20
acquiring plants have you tried the trading post on the discussion =
forum at=20
www.petflytrap.com ? =
Frequently=20
the folks there offer seeds or plants to interested parties. =
Just sending a post to the list to make shore it =
is working=20
on my end. I believe I introduced myself a while ago when I first =
posted to=20
the old list but, from that point I have gained a lot of other plants =
to add=20
to my grow list. I'm interested in anything I can get my hands on to=20
grow.
George McKay
------=_NextPart_000_0055_01C2E35E.23E730A0--
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Kit Halsted)
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2003 23:30:59 -0500
Subject: [CP] Re: New listserv etc
At 8:23 PM -0800 3/5/03, David Ahrens wrote:
<...>
>Lastly, is the new list up and running ? I have already received a posting
>from someone, even if it seems in a funny format. Can we use it from now ?
David:
It appears that both lists are operational now.
Rick:
Small comfort, perhaps, but the IT market in NYC hit bottom a while
back & has been getting better for a few months now. Good luck!
-Kit
--
Kit Halsted - kit@carnivorousplants.nyc.ny.us
Brooklyn, NY, USDA Zone 7a
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Rick Walker)
Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2003 20:42:40 -0800
Subject: [CP] The Listserv has now moved
The listserv is now moved to omnisterra.com.
Please send all CP correspondence to
cp@omnisterra.com
General information about the mailing list is at:
http://omnisterra.com/mailman/listinfo/cp_omnisterra.com
If you ever want to unsubscribe or change your options (eg, switch to
or from digest mode, change your password, etc.), visit your
subscription page by looking yourself up in the list at:
http://omnisterra.com/mailman/roster/cp_omnisterra.com
You can also make such adjustments via email by sending a message to:
cp-request@omnisterra.com
with the word `help' in the subject or body (don't include the
quotes), and you will get back a message with instructions.
You must know your password to change your options (including changing
the password, itself) or to unsubscribe.
If don't know your password, don't worry, you will receive a monthly
reminder telling you what all your omnisterra.com mailing list passwords
are, and how to unsubscribe or change your options. There is also a
button on your options page that will email your current password to
you.
You may also have your password mailed to you automatically off of the
Web page noted above.
Best regards,
--
Rick Walker
walker@omnisterra.com
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Malesiana Tropicals)
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 14:47:56 +0800
Subject: [CP] new list-server
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2E3EF.665AF0C0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Dear Goerge,
I am slightly confused by your email, what are you referring to below.
Kind regards,
Lisa
--
Malesiana Tropicals Sdn. Bhd.
1st Floor, Lot 4909, Sect. 64 KTLD, Upland Shop House, Jln. Upland 93300
Kuching, Sarawak, Malaysia
Phone: [int'l prefix]+(6082) 419-290
Fax: [int'l prefix]+(6082) 423-494 http://www.malesiana.tropicals.com.my
-----Original Message-----
Of ZITMCKAY@aol.com
Sent: 06 March 2003 10:35
To: Cp@omnisterra.com
Just sending a post to the list to make shore it is working on my end. I
believe I introduced myself a while ago when I first posted to the old
list but, from that point I have gained a lot of other plants to add to
my grow list. I'm interested in anything I can get my hands on to grow.
George McKay
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2E3EF.665AF0C0
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message
Dear=20
Goerge,
I am=20
slightly confused by your email, what are you referring to=20
below.
-----Original Message----- From:=20
Cp-admin@omnisterra.com [mailto:Cp-admin@omnisterra.com] On Behalf
=
Of=20
ZITMCKAY@aol.com Sent: 06 March 2003 10:35 To:
=
Cp@omnisterra.com Subject: [CP] new=20
list-server
Just sending a post to the =
list to make=20
shore it is working on my end. I believe I introduced myself a while =
ago when=20
I first posted to the old list but, from that point I have gained a =
lot of=20
other plants to add to my grow list. I'm interested in anything I can =
get my=20
hands on to grow.
George McKay =
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C2E3EF.665AF0C0--
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Steven Stewart)
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 16:17:05 -0500
Subject: [CP] Re: Nepenthes pitchers
> Is position on the stem the only determinate of whether a lower or upper
pitcher will be prodiced?
>
> Wayne
Hello Wayne,
No and yes. A Nepenthes can put out a growth point high up on an existing
stem and start producing lower pitchers. (above a point where upper pitchers
have been formed) The new growth point will form lower pitchers at the
bottom of the "new" stem. (the original stem is now potentially a rhizome)
There is probably someone on the list that can state this more correctly,
but I hope this helps.
Take care,
Steven Stewart
Florida, USA
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Georg J. Stach)
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 22:31:05 +0100
Subject: [CP] Listserv and solutions
Dear Rick,
Dear mailinglist readers,
Only two weeks ago I read about Agilent's downsizing and had to think
of you (Rick) and the CP database.
Now that you've been laid off, I wonder that you don't have
other sorrows than this mailing list! In these difficult times I wish
you to find a new job as soon as possible!
~ ~ ~
Rick's ANNOUNCEMENT was pretty humble, so I really feel urged to add
some points:
Firstly, it is not only the mailing list but also the CP database which
are provided by Agilent Labs. Also the database has to find a new
home.
You'll say this won't be a problem, just get a new domain, and webspace
doesn't cost much, BUT! you don't know the outlay which are behind
such a project like the CP database. It isn't sufficient to find some
low-cost provider, because one needs direct access to the server in
order to maintain the database and the services running on it.
You may be disappointed of hearing this, but services as mentioned
above start from 50$ upwards. Neat pocket money, huh? ;)
The same thing applies to the mailing list.
This is not just one mailing list but a list with over 2000 members
(as Rick told us). And everything in this dimensions costs money.
During receiving, composing and sending separate mails and the mailing
list, the mail server is heavily loaded, this means it is not available
for other tasks, furthermore it requires high loads of bandwidth which
is an enormous -- cost-intensive -- factor.
And you really think we just can move to Yahoo because it's free? NO!
Free services are fine as long as they are running, but you don't have
any guarantee how long they will do so. And I can really do without
ads.
Aside from the fact that we still didn't have a new location for the
CP database, Yahoo requires each and every member to subscribe from new.
My suggestion for a solution:
------------------------------
It is unacceptable to have Rick pay these cost-intensive
services, so the mailing list and the CP database should be integrated
as additional services of the ICPS. As such, the ICPS could pay the
fees for the webservices.
It would be smart to host www.carnivorousplants.org on the same server
of the mailing list and the CP database to reduce running costs.
We must keep in mind that it is _very_ (time)expensive to run and
maintain these web-services and that it requires much knowledge.
We are in Rick's debt to pay at least the accruing costs. In my
opinion, this can be best done by moving the services into the scope
of the ICPS. Then it's up to the ICPS whether only members but also
other CP enthusiasts can subscribe to the list.
If this "solution" should turn out as unfeasible, I'll have to
unsubscribe from the list. In any case, Rick shouldn't pay a penny for
the mailing list: He has made enough assiduous efforts for us.
Georg J. Stach
German Carnivorous Plants Society
www.carnivoren.org
Community: http://links.carnivoren.org/?p=10
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Jeff Lehmann)
Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 17:07:50 -0600
Subject: [CP] unsubcribe
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--Boundary_(ID_VZrwYo1xUJf9sW2vmcQ2Zg)
Content-type: text/plain; charset=Windows-1252
Content-transfer-encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE
I do not understand the unsubscribe method. I do not remember any pas=
sword
and I do not know what an =93address=94 field is.
Thanks
--Boundary_(ID_VZrwYo1xUJf9sW2vmcQ2Zg)
Content-type: text/html; charset=Windows-1252
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
I do not understand the unsubscribe method. I do not remember any
password and I do not know what an =93address=94 field =
is.
Thanks
--Boundary_(ID_VZrwYo1xUJf9sW2vmcQ2Zg)--
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Mark Todd)
Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2003 20:45:25 -0500
Subject: [CP] Possible solution for funding the new listserv
I've enjoyed this list for a couple of years. I think I have an idea that
might be the easiest for everybody.
If we take the cost of the new listserv and divide it by the number of
members, it would cover the cost and would be very little money. I don't
know the numbers but I think I read that the listserv is about $50 a month.
There are about 1000 members. If these estimates are correct that would come
out to $.05 a month for every member. That's $.60 a year. I understand there
may be currency difference so it may be that only the people in the USA can
support the listserv. I don't know how much that will add to the numbers
above, but I think it will still be a very small amount. If we all send $1
That will more than cover the listserv and can help cover the cp data base
too.
Another idea, If all the cp societies could add a voluntary donation for the
listserv to their memberships. That way nobody pays twice and nobody pays
for something that they don't use. The cp societies will have no interest in
the listserv since since it would be donations. The societies main interest
should be preservation of plants and getting new members. The best way to
keep people interested is to show them how to grow the plants properly. I
have learned so much from the people here. This listserv is one of the best
things to get people to keep interest in these plants by showing them how to
successfully grow them. So I think this list benefits all the cp societies.
Let me know what everybody else thinks about this.
Mark
PS If we all send one dollar for this listserv, who wants to send Michael P.
his notice for payment?
Paypal is nothing but hightech common thieves.
Check out their customer feedback
http://www.planetfeedback.com/sharedLettersList/0,2941,101112-70-0-0-20-0-fb_date-desc,00.html
Don't become another paypal victim
_________________________________________________________________
MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*.
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com ({USER_FIRSTNAME} {USER_LASTNAME})
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 23:08:01 -0500
Subject: [CP] Possible solution for funding the new listserv
Put the listserve on the ICPS website and change it to a bulletin board
format.
There isn't anything that bad here that warrants a moderated group, current
warnings regarding the list serve on the ICPS website could apply.
This would allow for easy scrolling of post that someone may want to view
and others they can avoid. Much easier that way for Herman in Germany to
avoid the squirrel post yearly. He can scroll over the post without getting
them in his mailbox.
I offer the further suggestion to consider is making CPN available as a
bi-monthly web magazine in addition to the quarterly with enhanced photos,,
and cultural information. It is time for this. I think there would be a
increase in subscriptions world wide for the International Society and the
cost would likely be less for a web based publication than the printed
material as well we could offer a more diverse format to new members with
many more photos. I feel there would be stronger worldwide memberships and
increased articles for publication. As for the short continue with a
printed quarterly, while investigating the interest in a web paid
subscription.
Lets jump into the 21st century. CPN is about the same size, less content
as the format started with in 1979. Far less cultural content......
Mike'
St. Petersburg Florida
----- Original Message -----
To:
Cc:
Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 8:45 PM
>
>
> I've enjoyed this list for a couple of years. I think I have an idea that
> might be the easiest for everybody.
> If we take the cost of the new listserv and divide it by the number of
> members, it would cover the cost and would be very little money. I don't
> know the numbers but I think I read that the listserv is about $50 a
month.
> There are about 1000 members. If these estimates are correct that would
come
> out to $.05 a month for every member. That's $.60 a year. I understand
there
> may be currency difference so it may be that only the people in the USA
can
> support the listserv. I don't know how much that will add to the numbers
> above, but I think it will still be a very small amount. If we all send $1
> That will more than cover the listserv and can help cover the cp data base
> too.
> Another idea, If all the cp societies could add a voluntary donation for
the
> listserv to their memberships. That way nobody pays twice and nobody pays
> for something that they don't use. The cp societies will have no interest
in
> the listserv since since it would be donations. The societies main
interest
> should be preservation of plants and getting new members. The best way to
> keep people interested is to show them how to grow the plants properly. I
> have learned so much from the people here. This listserv is one of the
best
> things to get people to keep interest in these plants by showing them how
to
> successfully grow them. So I think this list benefits all the cp
societies.
> Let me know what everybody else thinks about this.
> Mark
> PS If we all send one dollar for this listserv, who wants to send Michael
P.
> his notice for payment?
>
> Paypal is nothing but hightech common thieves.
> Check out their customer feedback
>
>
http://www.planetfeedback.com/sharedLettersList/0,2941,101112-70-0-0-20-0-fb
_date-desc,00.html
>
> Don't become another paypal victim
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*.
> http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Cp mailing list
> Cp@omnisterra.com
> http://omnisterra.com/mailman/listinfo/cp_omnisterra.com
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com ({USER_FIRSTNAME} {USER_LASTNAME})
Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 23:22:13 -0500
Subject: [CP] Possible solution for funding the new listserv
Hey I just sent this post and it came back to me like a darn boomerang
whacking me in the head.
What's up with this weird stuff in the twilight of the March 6, am I on the
ghost ship??
----- Original Message -----
To:
Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 11:08 PM
> Put the listserve on the ICPS website and change it to a bulletin board
> format.
> There isn't anything that bad here that warrants a moderated group,
current
> warnings regarding the list serve on the ICPS website could apply.
> This would allow for easy scrolling of post that someone may want to view
> and others they can avoid. Much easier that way for Herman in Germany to
> avoid the squirrel post yearly. He can scroll over the post without
getting
> them in his mailbox.
>
> I offer the further suggestion to consider is making CPN available as a
> bi-monthly web magazine in addition to the quarterly with enhanced
photos,,
> and cultural information. It is time for this. I think there would be a
> increase in subscriptions world wide for the International Society and the
> cost would likely be less for a web based publication than the printed
> material as well we could offer a more diverse format to new members with
> many more photos. I feel there would be stronger worldwide memberships
and
> increased articles for publication. As for the short continue with a
> printed quarterly, while investigating the interest in a web paid
> subscription.
>
> Lets jump into the 21st century. CPN is about the same size, less content
> as the format started with in 1979. Far less cultural content......
>
> Mike'
> St. Petersburg Florida
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mark Todd"
> To:
> Cc:
> Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 8:45 PM
> Subject: [CP] Possible solution for funding the new listserv
>
>
> >
> >
> > I've enjoyed this list for a couple of years. I think I have an idea
that
> > might be the easiest for everybody.
> > If we take the cost of the new listserv and divide it by the number of
> > members, it would cover the cost and would be very little money. I don't
> > know the numbers but I think I read that the listserv is about $50 a
> month.
> > There are about 1000 members. If these estimates are correct that would
> come
> > out to $.05 a month for every member. That's $.60 a year. I understand
> there
> > may be currency difference so it may be that only the people in the USA
> can
> > support the listserv. I don't know how much that will add to the numbers
> > above, but I think it will still be a very small amount. If we all send
$1
> > That will more than cover the listserv and can help cover the cp data
base
> > too.
> > Another idea, If all the cp societies could add a voluntary donation for
> the
> > listserv to their memberships. That way nobody pays twice and nobody
pays
> > for something that they don't use. The cp societies will have no
interest
> in
> > the listserv since since it would be donations. The societies main
> interest
> > should be preservation of plants and getting new members. The best way
to
> > keep people interested is to show them how to grow the plants properly.
I
> > have learned so much from the people here. This listserv is one of the
> best
> > things to get people to keep interest in these plants by showing them
how
> to
> > successfully grow them. So I think this list benefits all the cp
> societies.
> > Let me know what everybody else thinks about this.
> > Mark
> > PS If we all send one dollar for this listserv, who wants to send
Michael
> P.
> > his notice for payment?
> >
> > Paypal is nothing but hightech common thieves.
> > Check out their customer feedback
> >
> >
>
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From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Jan Schlauer)
Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 09:48:14 +0100
Subject: [CP] CPN format & contents
Dear Mike,
> I offer the further suggestion to consider is making CPN available as a
> bi-monthly web magazine in addition to the quarterly with enhanced
photos,,
> and cultural information.
I offer the suggestion you become the editor (and supposedly also the
primary or even the sole author) of this new format that should not be
called CPN in order to avoid confusion with the real thing.
> I think there would be a
> increase in subscriptions world wide for the International Society
and the
> cost would likely be less for a web based publication than the printed
> material as well we could offer a more diverse format to new members with
> many more photos.
> I feel there would be stronger worldwide memberships and
> increased articles for publication.
There is no reason to make me feel the same way.
> As for the short continue with a printed quarterly,
We will do so (not just for the short but for our entire readership).
> while investigating the interest in a web paid subscription.
Please feel free to do this yourself.
> Lets jump into the 21st century.
We are there already. Hurry up and join us!
> CPN is about the same size, less content
> as the format started with in 1979. Far less cultural content......
Facts, please! After I had posted a short summary on recent contents in
CPN, all discussions on our publishing policy have come to silence for
almost a year (until you revived this essentially void thread by your
recent message).
Anyway, thanks in advance for any useful suggestions, and especially for
suitable manuscript submissions!
Kind regards
Jan (CPN co-editor)
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Jan Schlauer)
Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 11:42:58 +0100
Subject: [CP] vft cultivars
Dear all,
VFTs without established cultivar names are grown under the "nicknames"
"Cup Trap" and "Pom Pom", respectively.
Perhaps it is little known that once the originator of a plant has
knowingly distributed it (by sale, gift, exchange, etc.), he/she does
not even need to be informed about the fact that the plant is being
described, and the originator does not need to agree with anything
(name, establishment, registration) whatsoever:
ICNCP Art. 22.6: "A new cultivar epithet is not established if its
publication is against the expressed wish of its originator or his
assignee, unless the originator or his assignee had knowingly
distributed that cultivar without a proposed cultivar epithet."
This means *anyone* who does have the plant is actually entitled to
describe it and to coin a cultivar name to his/her liking. This might
sound unfair because it neglects what might be regarded the rights and
wishes of the originator but it must not be forgotten that it is
exclusively the originator's choice whether he/she wants to distribute
the plants before they are named properly or not. If the originator
distributes plants previous to establishment of a cultivar name, all
rights (of the originator) regarding the name are void.
If someone on this list does grow one or both of the above mentioned
plants, please consider describing them in a publication (e.g. in CPN or
any other journal read by cp growers) in order to establish cultivar
names for them.
If this has been done already (and I have just not noticed it), please
inform me about any pertinent publication.
If you have any questions regarding cp cultivar naming or description,
please feel free to ask me (here or by private email:
jan.schlauer@uni-tuebingen.de).
Thank you very much for your help.
Kind regards
Jan (ICPS, International Registrar)
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Karl-Heinz Tessner)
Date: 07 Mar 2003 13:38 GMT
Subject: [CP] (no subject)
--=20
Karl-Heinz Tessner
Ulbarger Strasse 22
26629 Timmel
Deutschland / Germany
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Chris Teichreb)
Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 07:56:12 -0800
Subject: [CP] vft cultivars
Hello Jan,
>This means *anyone* who does have the plant is actually entitled to
>describe it and to coin a cultivar name to his/her liking. This might sound
>unfair because it neglects what might be regarded the rights and wishes of
>the originator but it must not be forgotten that it is exclusively the
>originator's choice whether he/she wants to distribute the plants before
>they are named properly or not. If the originator distributes plants
>previous to establishment of a cultivar name, all rights (of the
>originator) regarding the name are void.
>
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the ICPS encouraged distribution
of a plant among growers prior to naming it as a cultivar. By doing this,
it ensures it is in cultivation and others deem it worthy. This avoids
having all of these cultivar names for plants that were never properly
distributed, or just plain unworthy of cultivar status in the opinion of the
general cp community.
I can see why naming prior to distribution is preferred, as it avoid the
confusion between nicknames and true cultivar names. However, I look
through the list of recently named cultivars and rarely see half of them on
sellers or traders lists.
Is there a way for a grower to secure a the right to describe a
particular cultivar without actually registering it until they have
distributed it? That way, as stated above, it would ensure it was secure in
cultivation and deemed worthy by others of cultivar status.
Cheers!
Chris
_________________________________________________________________
Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online
http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Rollins)
Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 11:37:03 -0800
Subject: [CP] Electronic NewsLetter
Electronic News Letter? Not for me. I like to hold the thing in my hands
and pick it up and read it 10 , 20 years from now.
Mainly, this was to see if I could get a message posted to the new list
serv.
James A. Rollins
[mailto:willows@rose.net]
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com ({USER_FIRSTNAME} {USER_LASTNAME})
Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:02:53 -0500
Subject: [CP] CPN format & contents
Dear Jan,
Please calm down, I was making no personal reference to the job you were
doing or the quality of the publication. The suggestions were just that for
consideration into the future. It is very clear how articles get published
in CPN thanks to you and that wasn't what I was bringing up. If no one
submits articles, nothing can be printed. Content wasn't the message, if I
wasn't clear I am sorry for that.
My mistake was I meant "we" are in (and yes I am a member Jan so I will
continue to make suggestions rather you like it or not - I pay my dues and
have been around since the beginning) the same format since March of 1978
(not 1979), the first year the change was made from the stapled newsletter
from the mid 70's start up.
I doubt I have the skills needed to be a Editor, but I could give it a try.
Most likely though I would deny it and try my best to be fair the CPN at
that point would lean towards cultural content over more scientific
genetic/lab work and nomenclature. This is simply because that's what
interest me more. All publications are swayed by the Editorial content and
remembered that way.
For instance the Washington Post Newspaper or New York Times may report the
news but both are known for leaning a certain direction editorially.
If I could be of any help, sign me up, but I won't lick stamps !!!
Jan you honestly don't feel in the not to distant future that interest could
grow with using the web for publication? The example of the official ICPS
site is excellent, professionally done, interesting, & maintained. It is
building nicely with expanding information. Worth a look and then another
look on a regular basis to see what's new. More trade and professional
publications are being made available as paid subscriptions on-line in
various formats. The information can be expanded, is more timely, and
allows for more photo opportunity over a costly printed format. I would
think, it could streamline the help & labor needed to publish a printed
Journal.
It allows for more experimentation to see what works and what may not. It
allows millions worldwide to sit in their homes to discover things they may
never have found or had access to by past conventional means. It is a
excellent resource for marketing when used carefully.
The major drawback is that sitting at a computer screen isn't the same as
having a hard copy in your hands and the freedom to look at it at ones
leisure. This is a major drawback. You can find that on-line catalogs for
mail order stores may be better detailed than a printed catalog but request
for a hard copy of a catalog still are very high.
In the future I predict that many more periodicals will be only available
through the web as printing, labor, & postage continue to rise. Formats for
copying the on-line publications such as pdf will become more used by the
home computer for producing hard copies.
Jan you are a very irritable sounding type of guy , and your sarcasm was
noted in your demeaning reply to me. One word sums it up "Grump" (I bet
you say I come off as some kind of nut case, well you are not far from the
truth).
But maybe that was because you thought I was attacking the way articles are
submitted and published which is personal and I wasn't making comments
regarding this past issue.
You ask in your reply so here are some suggestions,........................
If I can submit something of use to the CPN I will. Barry contacted me man
months ago regarding co-writing a article with Doug Darnowski. I would
gladly write something, but in this case I didn't have the expertise needed
to pull my end of the article so I declined. The article Barry suggested is
excellent and would be extremely interesting to most readers of the CPN and
I hope it will be completed.
Further I am writing a article for future submission which is dreadfully
needed this is on treating fungal disease on the plants. It is simply
astounding to me that this most common killer of moist, warm, humid growing
cp has not been gone into with any general information let alone detail in
publications to this date. This will take sometime as I get the facts right
and gather general data. More cp die off in collections due to fungal
disease than anything else, regardless of the cause this is the killer of
plants we grow.
I suggest a regular Genus/species/cultivar column in every CPN, though done
in the past cultural data changes and even repeated information would be
welcomed. I will write on what I have long term experience growing.
Give me a list I will contact growers and ask them if they would be
interested in being a special guest writer regarding a special plant they
grow well. We can do some short human interest feature as well as plants on
the members of the ICPS
- Hello Charles Brewer we would like you to write a article on your
experiences with growing Cephalotus
- Hello Fernando in Brazil we would like to write a article on your
experience and a biography regarding your cp travels (human interest)
- Hello Philip Sheridan we would like to run a article on your operation
with photos and a bio of you
-Hello Mike King CPN would be grateful if you would consider writing a
article on how you grow such fine Sarracenia in England .
-Hello Dean Cook we would like to do a article with photos of your favorite
plants and notes how you grow them in the Pacific NW.
- Hello Ivan Snyder how about a article for the June 2008 CPN regarding your
interest with nomenclature of Drosera?
- Hey Big Ed Munn you can grow those D. schrizandra like no one I have ever
seen how about a article on growing these in a terrarium set in your living
room for the CPN (most people don't have greenhouse's and these type of
articles are important).
.... yes I can do this, sign me up! I volunteer today.
Well those are my facts for you and I am sticking with them.
Please don't be such a meanie,
Regards,
Mike
St. Petersburg Florida
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (TamlinD Dawnstar)
Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 09:04:03 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [CP] Re: Cultivar Publication
--0-953637059-1047056643=:10422
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Dear Jan, I was wondering if the publication of cultivar status is
restricted to the printed media (I assume it is). Wouldn't it be
wonderful if the publication could happen in a faster fashion than
allowed by conventional printed publication? Perhaps a future
consideration might be the establishment of a dedicated web site to host
photos and information regarding these cultivars - with stipulation that
the approved entries be backed up in a hard copy, and placed
appropriately in predetermined botanical libraries. If the information
was burned to CD, these are easily copied and can be made as readily
accessible as printed media. I envision a yearly updated CD containing
all new entries, much like an annual Journal publication, distributed to
the libraries, along with a conventional annual printing of the same
material (needed since electronic recording media changes over time).
Since this is under ICPS auspicies, the cost could and should be
underwritten by society members, and the ICPN could publish the address
of the website prominently, thereby affording its members (and
incidently, the rest of the world) a readily accessible cultivar data
base. Such a dedicated web site could contain contact information of
the originator of the cultivar, photos, advice. If the only restriction
to this concept is the question "who will do it", I believe that there
are willing members of our community who will make this effort for the
good of all. I think part of the reason no one registers these plants
as cultivars is the paucity of acceptable journals for cultivar
publication. The ICPN could not handle a serious and concerted effort
to legitimize these common (but bogus) assignations by the CP community,
even if all were willing to fully embrace the concept. The CPN backlog
would stretch for years! I picture my proposal as working like this: If
someone wanted to publish a cultivar they would write the description,
attach the requisite photo(s) and email these to you. You would then
assess the entry, and if acceptable after appropriate review, forward
the file with your approval to the webmaster who then 1) enters it on
the site (which entry carries a time/date stamp) and 2) backs it
immediately to hard copy (stored in a couple of different places).
Please consider and forward this concept, if you feel it has merit, to
anyone with the capacity to make decisions regarding this protocol. I
feel that with a speedier and more accessible vehicle of acceptable
publication, many of these plants at last could have the legitimate name
they deserve and are commonly referred to by, and we could begin
intelligent discussion about what we grow, and what we think we grow.
The internet is a powerful tool of communication, I hope we can utilize
it to help bring intelligent resolution to the guessing game of "who has
which what".
In closing, I wish to express my personal admiration for Rick Walker's
work, ethics, and focus. Hats off to you my man!
Yours,
William Dawnstar
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more
--0-953637059-1047056643=:10422
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
Dear Jan,
I was wondering if the publication of cultivar
status is restricted to the printed media (I assume it is).
Wouldn't it be wonderful if the publication could happen in a faster
fashion than allowed by conventional printed publication?
Perhaps a
future consideration might be the establishment of a dedicated web site
to host photos and information regarding these cultivars - with
stipulation that the approved entries be backed up in a hard copy, and
placed appropriately in predetermined botanical libraries. If the
information was burned to CD, these are easily copied and can be made as
readily accessible as printed media. I envision a yearly updated
CD containing all new entries, much like an annual Journal publication,
distributed to the libraries, along with a conventional annual printing
of the same material (needed since electronic recording media changes
over time). Since this is under ICPS auspicies, the
cost could and should be underwritten by society members, and the
ICPN could publish the address of the website prominently, thereby
affording its members (and incidently, the rest of the world) a readily
accessible cultivar data base.
Such a dedicated web site
could contain contact information of the originator of the cultivar,
photos, advice. If the only restriction to this concept is the
question "who will do it", I believe that there are willing members of
our community who will make this effort for the good of all.
I think
part of the reason no one registers these plants as
cultivars is the paucity of acceptable journals for cultivar
publication. The ICPN could not handle a serious and concerted
effort to legitimize these common (but bogus) assignations by the CP
community, even if all were willing to fully embrace the
concept. The CPN backlog would stretch for years!
I
picture my proposal as working like this: If someone wanted to
publish a cultivar they would write the description, attach the
requisite photo(s) and email these to you. You would
then assess the entry, and if acceptable after appropriate review,
forward the file with your approval to the webmaster who then 1)
enters it on the site (which entry carries a time/date stamp) and
2) backs it immediately to hard copy (stored in a couple of different
places).
Please consider and forward this concept, if you feel
it has merit, to anyone with the capacity to make decisions regarding
this protocol. I feel that with a speedier and more accessible
vehicle of acceptable publication, many of these plants at
last could have the legitimate name they deserve and are commonly
referred to by, and we could begin intelligent discussion about what we
grow, and what we think we grow. The internet is a powerful tool
of communication, I hope we can utilize it to help bring intelligent
resolution to the guessing game of "who has which what".
In closing, I wish to express my personal admiration
for Rick Walker's work, ethics, and focus. Hats off to you my
man!
Yours,
William Dawnstar
Do you
Yahoo!? Yahoo!
Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, and more
--0-953637059-1047056643=:10422--
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Cp@omnisterra.com)
Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 12:27:09 -0500
Subject: [CP] CPN format & contents
Mike,
That was very well worded and very well written. Who wrote it for
you? HAHAHAHA_cough, cough.... Really, very well put. I understand
as well, you can only print what you have. I would love to see every
issue have some kind of cultivation article as well(I even have a
dormant BS in Biology and care more for cultivation articles), whether
it be "how to grow" or a cultivar announcement. I have heard of Ed
Munn, but never what he grows. I would love a private e-mail on how
to grow giant D. schizandra, if he does not want to submit an article.
That sounds like a winner. Scientific articles belong too, and I love
it when Andreas Wistuba presents a new species in CPN. It's the
perfect place for papers like that. I would like to see CPN printed
as it is. The reason being, I like to have something to hold and read
that looks nice, and
there are a few members out there that might not have a computer.
Computers really open up the hobby and I don't have to glumly wait for
CPN in my mailbox to get nourishment like I did years ago.
I think Peter Thiel has a e-mag on cp that you can get to from the
web-ring, so we can have a online publication and a published manual.
Anyhow good feedback is nice to do once in a while.
Regards,
Joe Griffin
Lincoln, NE USA
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Cp@omnisterra.com)
Date: Fri, 07 Mar 2003 12:47:30 -0500
Subject: [CP] Re: Nepenthes pitchers
Wayne,
As Steven pointed out, the answer to the casual query is yes; in general
terms, the position on the stem is a determinant of pitcher type.
However, I've often found examples in the wild and in cultivation of
plants clearly violating this trend. Its occurrence is commensurate
with those traits that are commonly associated with apical dominance in
other genera, or as is the case here, a lack of it.
If you are looking for overkill, read on; apical dominance is the
inhibition of axillary bud germination (through plant growth regulator
production) by the primary shoot. To simplify grossly, a balance is
struck between those phytoregulators produced by the roots, cytokinins,
and those produced by the tissues flanking the apical meristem, auxins,
setting up a chemical gradient along the length of the plant. As you
might know cytokinins such as BAP, are added to in vitro cultures to
stimulate shoot multiplication - well of course, they do the very same
thing in planta.
This is why your Nepenthes specimen invariably produces basal offshoots
once its climbing stem has torn through the top of your house and
decimated the neighbourhood sparrow population; the cytokinin:auxin
ratio at the base of the plant is raised, with the excess cytokinin
causing shoot proliferation to occur.
Does this answer your question? Well, no, it doesn't, but it
introduces a concept that is key to understanding how what you described
is so readily observable under certain circumstances; apical dominance
can be reduced through excessive leggy growth, by cutting off the top of
the plant, and even by lowering the primary growth to a level lower than
the remainder of the plant. The latter point is very often a cause of
the development of traits associated with the basal parts of plants in
atypical positions, and is used extensively in horticulture (horizontal
layering, éspalier-style growing of fruit trees to increase production
&c.).
An easy demo is to take a cutting of growth producing upper pitchers;
they very often revert to lower or intermediate pitcher production for a
time following rooting, before zipping back to upper pitcher production
relatively quickly. This happens because the growth of roots causes
cytokinin production, lowering the local cytokinin:auxin ratio. This
state of affairs doesn't last very long, since the internodal distance
of such cuttings is fairly large from the outset, and quickly brings on
a reduction in apical dominance with each leaf produced.
Whew. We can take this offlist if I've managed to confuse. I'm
setting up a forum for Nepenthes (forum.happenchance.com) anyhow, and
since the current population is zero, I'd welcome such discussion,
though I haven't yet had time enough off from the lab to populate the
forum categories. Any input welcome.
Best wishes,
Alastair
----------------------------------
Alastair Robinson
Institute of Biotechnology
University of Cambridge
Tennis Court Road
Cambridge CB2 1QT UK
Tel: +44 (1223) 334165
Fax: +44 (1223) 334162
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Cp@omnisterra.com)
Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 12:55:16 EST
Subject: [CP] Nepenthes Ventricosa
--part1_f9.2a9ed2e5.2b9a3704_boundary
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What were to happen if a Nepenthes Ventricosa was accidently broken in
half?= =A0=20 i.e. some leaves left on the root section and the top
half with a few=20 leaves.=A0 Is there any way to save both parts?=A0
How fast would growth be=20= for=20 either half?
Not to worry, my N. ventricosa's are safe and sound=A0 :o)
Also, how "tall" will a N. ventricosa grow?=A0 I've only got a couple of bab=
ies=20
right now, one with 4" long lives and the other with 3" long leaves.=A0 They=
=20
are doing great on my windowsill.=A0 Got a 10 inch long leaf N. ventricosa=20
coming in the mail as soon as the shipping weather improves=A0 :o)
Oh yes and one more question, I'm planning on putting all of my N. ventricos=
a=20
into one large hanging basket, I'd like to gow one or two more nepenthes as=20
well in the same hanging basket, what other Nepenthes could you recommend=20
with similar needs of N. ventrcosa that would thrive in a windowsill=20
condition? I've read the books, but I'd like to have some personal insight=20
into this as well. Thanks a bunch, as always, everyone on this list has=20
fabulous insight and view points!
Christine & Lucy the Giant Schnauzer
Isle Of L=
ucy
Great Minds think alike, but Giant Minds think for themselves.
--part1_f9.2a9ed2e5.2b9a3704_boundary
Content-Type: text/html; charset="ISO-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
What were to happen if a Nepenthes
Ventricosa was acci= dently broken in half?=A0 i.e. some leaves left on
the root section and the=20= top half with a few leaves.=A0 Is there any
way to save both parts?=A0 How f= ast would growth be for either
half?
Not to worry, my N. ventricosa's are safe and sound=A0
:o)
Also, how "tall" will a N. ventricosa grow?=A0 I've only
got a couple of bab= ies right now, one with 4" long lives and the other
with 3" long leaves.=A0=20= They are doing great on my windowsill.=A0
Got a 10 inch long leaf N. ventric= osa coming in the mail as soon as
the shipping weather improves=A0 :o)
Oh yes and one more
question, I'm planning on putting all of my N. ventricos= a into one
large hanging basket, I'd like to gow one or two more nepenthes a= s
well in the same hanging basket, what other Nepenthes could you
recommend=20= with similar needs of N. ventrcosa that would thrive in a
windowsill conditi= on? I've read the books, but I'd like to have
some personal insight in= to this as well. Thanks a bunch, as
always, everyone on this list has=20= fabulous insight and view
points!
Christine & Lucy the Giant
Schnauzer<=
FONT COLOR=3D"#000000" style=3D"BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff" SIZE=3D2
FAMILY= =3D"SANSSERIF" FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0"> Isle Of Lucy Great Minds think alike, but
Giant Minds think for themselves.
--part1_f9.2a9ed2e5.2b9a3704_boundary--
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (wouter)
Date: Sat, 08 Mar 2003 16:54:45 +0100
Subject: [CP] Trip to Carniflora
Hi fellow Cp'ers,
A few weeks ago I mentioned about a dutch nursery Carniflora in Holland.
Saturday 24th of May I orginise a trip to this nursery.
I want to invite everyone to come to this commercial nursery. There will
be many members of the Dutch, Belgium and German Cp society. And even
a few from the UK.
This nursery is easilly to reach by carr or by train and is very close
to Schiphol, Amsterdam Airport.
They grow some nice Sarracenia hybrids like S. excellens, but also
Byblis liniflora, Darlingtonia and Drosera regia. I have many pictures of
this nursery, so feel free to ask.
I can also send you a map of the area where Carniflora is located, so you
can find your way to Carniflora.
Look on their website www.carniflora.nl/dutch
The prices are very cheap! They grow most of the plants in 12 or 8 cm pots.
Most of the Sarraccenia in 8 cm pots are 1,25 Euro p.p. The larger plants in 12 pots are 3,50 Euro p.p.
Feel free to ask information about the trip!
Take care,
Wouter Noordeloos
Carnivora
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Barry A. Rice)
Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 15:59:50 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [CP] ICPS and the CP listserve
Hey Folks,
Just a virtual appearance between business trips..
What a drag that the CP listserve is having to change. It is too bad when
something that is working well has to be messed with.
I'm not a board member of the ICPS, so my opinions have no more strength
than anyone else's on this listserve, but here are my few cents....
1)I don't like yahoo groups. In my experience, "free services" are not
around for very long. Also, I don't trust companies like Yahoo to be
invested in notions of the public good. They are motivated by profit. So I
would not trust Yahoo groups to not sell our email addresses, etc.
2)I think that the ICPS (or a consortium of CP societies) should support
the CP listserve for the long term. I read the criticism that the entire
ICPS membership might not benefit from supporting the listserve, but don't
consider this important. After all, not everyone benefits from every
action the ICPS does anyway. For example, some people in the ICPS may not
care about conservation, but the ICPS has an active conservation program.
The listserve would fit perfectly with the ICPS's mission statement of
contributing to the distribution of information about CP! I'm sure it
would fit well with the mission statement of other CP societies, too.
There is probably the concern that someone making inflammatory remarks on
the listserve could fly in the face of the ICPS. For example, maybe
someone could sue the ICPS if their feelings were hurt on the listserve? I
don't know if this is a realistic concern, but suspect some kind of
firewall language could be inserted in the listserve description to
protect the ICPS (or a consortium of CP societies) from goofy litigious
people looking for an easy buck.
Cheers
Barry
------------------------
Barry A. Rice, Ph.D.
Carnivorous Plant Newsletter
Conservation Coeditor
barry@carnivorousplants.org
http://www.carnivorousplants.org
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Frederick JM Depuydt)
Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 03:56:35 +0100
Subject: [CP] Nepenthes coccinea upper pitcher
Hello,
has anybody ever witnessed or preferably photographed a Nepenthes
coccinea upper pitcher?
Cheers,
Frederick
Need a new email address that people can remember
Check out the new EudoraMail at
http://www.eudoramail.com
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com ({USER_FIRSTNAME} {USER_LASTNAME})
Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2003 22:16:06 -0500
Subject: [CP] Nepenthes coccinea upper pitcher
Its possible
----- Original Message -----
To:
Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2003 9:56 PM
> Hello,
>
> has anybody ever witnessed or preferably photographed a Nepenthes
> coccinea upper pitcher?
>
> Cheers,
> Frederick
>
>
> Need a new email address that people can remember
> Check out the new EudoraMail at
> http://www.eudoramail.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> Cp mailing list
> Cp@omnisterra.com
> http://omnisterra.com/mailman/listinfo/cp_omnisterra.com
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Malesiana Tropicals)
Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 16:24:31 +0800
Subject: [CP] new list-server
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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Dear George,
Are you still interested to receive the attached invoice. Did you cancel
it?
Kind regards,
Lisa
--
Malesiana Tropicals Sdn. Bhd.
1st Floor, Lot 4909, Sect. 64 KTLD, Upland Shop House, Jln. Upland 93300
Kuching, Sarawak, Malaysia
Phone: [int'l prefix]+(6082) 419-290
Fax: [int'l prefix]+(6082) 423-494 http://www.malesiana.tropicals.com.my
-----Original Message-----
Of ZITMCKAY@aol.com
Sent: 06 March 2003 10:35
To: Cp@omnisterra.com
Just sending a post to the list to make shore it is working on my end. I
believe I introduced myself a while ago when I first posted to the old
list but, from that point I have gained a lot of other plants to add to
my grow list. I'm interested in anything I can get my hands on to grow.
George McKay
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Message
Dear=20
George,
Are=20
you still interested to receive the attached invoice. Did you cancel=20
it?
-----Original Message----- From:=20
Cp-admin@omnisterra.com [mailto:Cp-admin@omnisterra.com] On Behalf
=
Of=20
ZITMCKAY@aol.com Sent: 06 March 2003 10:35 To:
=
Cp@omnisterra.com Subject: [CP] new=20
list-server
Just sending a post to the =
list to make=20
shore it is working on my end. I believe I introduced myself a while =
ago when=20
I first posted to the old list but, from that point I have gained a =
lot of=20
other plants to add to my grow list. I'm interested in anything I can =
get my=20
hands on to grow.
George McKay =
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From: Cp@omnisterra.com (mike wilder)
Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 11:05:28 +0000
Subject: [CP] cultivars
hello chris,
you are right that there are many people who have expressed the hope that
cultivars will be widely distributed before they are named; even the icps
website has helped spread the idea that cultivars should be "worthy",
excellent, outstanding, etc. but it is important for everyone to realize
that the icps does not and cannot govern the rules of nomenclature regarding
cultivars. we can suggest a million ideas that would be "better" or appear
sensible but they really have no weight; anyone who agrees to follow the
rules simply must without modification. and jan and others have no intention
of not following them. this is not an irrational position, even if some
disagree with it. but it does have the consequence that anyone can name any
plant for any reason, so long as that person "distinguishes" the plant for
some reason, and if that distinguishing feature or features can be described
in the appropriate way (i.e., according to the rules.) the code makes no
mention of worthiness, excellence or outstandingness as necessary or
sufficient criteria for ascribing cultivar status. "distinguishability" is
all that matters. so it ultimately doesn't matter whether anyone has or
appreciates a cultivar aside from the namer, at least as far the question:
does plant x deserve a cultivar name? only the namer need think so.
there are two ways the interpret these facts:
1. the nomenclatural rules are stupid and the icps shouldn't follow them. a
person who argues for this view ought to be qualified to edit the cpn and
ought to be willing to personally tell the nomenclatural authorities that
the icps is pulling out of its agreement to be a registering authority.
2. the rules are imperfect or not "ideal", just like everything else that
humans have a hand in. the rules are nicely democratic and declare that all
growers are equally qualified to determine whether a given plant is
"distinguishable" and therefore worthy of a cultivar name.
i post this not to attack you chris at all (and certainly not in
particular.) it's just that these matters have been argued back and forth
repeatedly, including by me. so i hope it will benefit everyone to at least
see what the icps can and cannot do regarding cultivars. it can't write new
rules, unless it abandons the code. as a practical matter, if someone has a
plant they think may merit cultivar status, and if they want confirmation or
feedback before naming it, it shouldn't be too difficult for them to find
trustworthy people who can receive and evaluate clones with this
understanding. but this practical method cannot be formalized by the icps as
a sort of rule; it doesn't have this authority. in any case, i myself have
found that it is much easier to question the code than it is to write a
better one. this does not of course prevent me from giddily circulating
plants with wholly invalid names like p. sp. "la vuelta", "molango", "sierra
obscura", ad infinitum. that there is a standardized way of naming plants
accepted by our community does not prevent anyone from celebrating and
perpetuating idiolects [except in the pages of the cpn, and i guess except
for sp. "floating"] :)
mike wilder
www.geocities.com/pingenstein
_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (delphine dubois)
Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 20:44:43 +0400
Subject: [CP] seeds to trade
C'est un message de format MIME en plusieurs parties.
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hi!
i have seeds of:
- drosera capensis sp
- drosera binata var. multifida
- dionaea muscipula
- darlingtonia californica=20
- sarracenia flava rugelli
to swap.
in exchange, i'm looking for seeds of drosera:
cistiflora
madagascariensis
pilosa
pauciflora
prolifera
regia
slackii
ascendens
banksii
caledonica
dielsiana
esterhuyseniae
hamiltonii
graminifolia
chrysolepis
indica
montana var montana
montana var schwackei
romaimae
sessilifolia
trinervia
venusta
i swap in small amounts only for the moment.
contact me.
thanks.
deedee
***
pseudo/nickname aim (aol), messenger (msn & yahoo) : darlingtonia974
icq : 328465923 darlingtonia974
http://site.voila.fr/carniland
plantes carnivores / carnivorous plants
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From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Cp@omnisterra.com)
Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 12:43:51 EST
Subject: [CP] attachments
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Rick;
As a suggestion, might I recommend that the listserv not allow attachments.
Due to the prevalence of viruses being sent by e-mail attachments, this could
be asking for trouble.
TTFN
Hamir the Hermit
"The party in question, managed to aggravate the CID,
Gave them my address, now they're after me.
Living without fear, living without a straight career,
Living without fear, you, and your great ideas."
--part1_173.16d1a2ee.2b9cd757_boundary
Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Rick;
As a suggestion, might I recommend that the listserv not allow attachments.&=
nbsp; Due to the prevalence of viruses being sent by e-mail attachments, thi=
s could be asking for trouble.
TTFN
Hamir the Hermit
"The party in questi=
on, managed to aggravate the CID,
Gave them my address, now they're after me.
Living without fear, living without a straight career,
Living without fear, you, and your great ideas."
--part1_173.16d1a2ee.2b9cd757_boundary--
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (kinyon)
Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 09:49:42 -0800
Subject: [CP] boring webcam take 3
This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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Hey folks,
The Darlingtonia bloomed, so its on my webcam today at "goof.camarades.com"
Watching plants grow at the speed of light!
Joseph Kinyon
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Hey=20
folks,
The =
Darlingtonia=20
bloomed, so its on my webcam today at =
"goof.camarades.com"
Watching plants grow=20
at the speed of light!
Joseph =
Kinyon
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From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Georg J. Stach)
Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 19:31:13 +0100
Subject: [CP] attachments
Hi Rick,
additionally all HTML-parts and other non-text/plain-MIME-contents
should be cut away by the listserve-parser, if possible. :-)
Thanks
Georg
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Tim Malcolm)
Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 11:46:51 -0700
Subject: [CP] HTML in messages
Is there any way to prevent html-formatted messages from being
distributed by the list? Currently, about half of the content of my
digests is taken up by unreadable duplicated copies formatted in html.
tim.
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Ivan Snyder)
Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 11:06:49 -0800
Subject: [CP] CPN format & contents
- Hello Ivan Snyder how about a article for the June 2008 CPN regarding
your
interest with nomenclature of Drosera?
Regards,
Mike
St. Petersburg Florida
Hi Mike and all,
I see we have all crossed over to the next plain successfully. Thanks to
Rick for making this all possible. I enjoy both CP Digest and CPN in
their present format. I do not have internet access, only e-mail at home.
I would be happy to contribute such an article for CPN. It is sure
to receive a compromising annotation in the form of a biased and even
hostile editorial comment. Seems this sort of conflict actually appeals
to readers here. A species will have the most competition with members of
its own. Competition is needed to progress. Man has proven to be an
exceptionally aggressive and competitive species. Certainly the greatest
on this world. Be proud?
Ivan
________________________________________________________________
Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today
Only $9.95 per month!
Visit www.juno.com
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Cp@omnisterra.com)
Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 15:11:53 EST
Subject: [CP] html crud
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Is it just me or is there an awful lot of html crud in the digest? What a
pain to find the new messages among the html code and reply to reply to
reply.
Tony
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Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Is it just me or is there an awful lot of
html crud in=
the digest? What a pain to find the new messages among the html
code=20=
and reply to reply to reply. Tony
--part1_18e.176aaec6.2b9cfa09_boundary--
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Gary Kong)
Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 15:25:15 -0500
Subject: [CP] html crud
I'm receiving individual emails to an account that is specifically for
this listserve and anything related to it. I'm currently having no
trouble with html tags and am receiving everything in plain text,
although a couple of attachments have made their way through. Perhaps
if you set your preferences to receive individual emails as they arrive,
you would alleviate your html-in-digest woes.
Gary Kong
NTnChubbs@aol.com wrote:
>Is it just me or is there an awful lot of html crud in the digest? What a
>pain to find the new messages among the html code and reply to reply to
>reply.
>Tony
>
--
San Francisco, CA
World Leader Pretend: http://www.foulds2000.freeserve.co.uk/bushv5.htm
__________________________________________________________________
The NEW Netscape 7.0 browser is now available. Upgrade now! http://channels.netscape.com/ns/browsers/download.jsp
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From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Rick Walker)
Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2003 12:53:27 -0800
Subject: [CP] Re: attachments
"Georg J. Stach" writes:
> additionally all HTML-parts and other non-text/plain-MIME-contents
> should be cut away by the listserve-parser, if possible. :-)
"Tim Malcolm" writes:
> Is there any way to prevent html-formatted messages from being
> distributed by the list? Currently, about half of the content of my
> digests is taken up by unreadable duplicated copies formatted in html.
The main disadvantage with using an ISP service and not running my own
server is that I cannot easily create custom scripts for processing the
mail. The old Agilent listserv was heavily customized to edit out mime
text, SPAM, images, attachements and to do automatic line wrapping... etc.
Several possibilities suggest themselves, though. Currently, I have
subscribed everyone to receive "plain" mail. You can set your
preferences to receive MIME digests instead. Then if you run a MIME
compatible mail reader you wont see all the gunk that is generated by
people using internet explorer and other "fancy" mail clients.
The second suggestion is that we continue to kindly encourage everyone
to send plain ASCII messages. To enforce this will require gentle
education and constant periodic reminders (ideally in the form of
private email suggestions) to the new members who aren't yet
listserv-savvy.
Using MIME or HTML on a listserv is an indication of someone who is
still learning the ropes. Please encourage such people to try to "get
with the program" ASAP to keep the CP list as pleasant as possible.
Maybe we can create a FAQ explaining how to shut off MIME for some common
mail programs (Pine, ELM, Netscape, IE, Eudora, etc).
In most mail programs, there will be a way to "Set Preferences" for
Mail. Please select "plain ASCII" or turn off "MIME" and "HTML"
formatting. Such encoding is usually utterly irrelevant for our
purposes because it tries to set fonts that may not exist on most
computers, or tries to justify the text in ways which are incompatible
with many of our readers.
Use of these proprietary formats typically expands the message,
bandwidth and disk space used by at least 2.5x for MIME and about 15x
for encoded Microsoft Word files.
I'm happy to try to help anyone, or to try to clarify these points if
there is any confusion.
I'll also see if there is a way that I can set up a mail alias
to run all incoming mail through some filtering scripts.
I just breathed a sigh of relief to have the list running at all.
The cosmetic touches may take a while longer :-).
kind regards,
--
Rick Walker
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Christopher Armstrong)
Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 18:03:13 -0500
Subject: [CP] Nepenthes growing points
Hello all,
I have a very old, rather branchy N. alata witch I just repotted a couple
weeks ago. I removed three climbing stems and left one to grow. Now the
plant has gone crazy and has started to send out 13 (I counted) new growing
points. Would it diminish the pitchers to let all 13 points grow (witch I
think would look pretty impressive), or should I remove some of them?
Regards, Jonathan Armstrong
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Steve LaWarre)
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 08:34:32 -0500
Subject: [CP] Nepenthes growing points
Hey Jonathan,
IF you have that Nep in a BIG container, It should do just fine. I find =
that big plants will support lots of basal growth just fine as long as =
they have lots of room. Keep it in a BIG container and watch it go =
crazy.
Steve LaWarre
Grand Rapids, MI=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Christopher Armstrong [mailto:gollum0@bellsouth.net]
> Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2003 6:03 PM
> To: Cp@omnisterra.com
> Subject: [CP] Nepenthes growing points
>=20
>=20
> Hello all,
> I have a very old, rather branchy N. alata witch I just=20
> repotted a couple
> weeks ago. I removed three climbing stems and left one to=20
> grow. Now the
> plant has gone crazy and has started to send out 13 (I=20
> counted) new growing
> points. Would it diminish the pitchers to let all 13 points=20
> grow (witch I
> think would look pretty impressive), or should I remove some of them?
>=20
> Regards, Jonathan Armstrong
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Cp mailing list
> Cp@omnisterra.com
> http://omnisterra.com/mailman/listinfo/cp_omnisterra.com
>=20
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com ({USER_FIRSTNAME} {USER_LASTNAME})
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 08:45:06 -0500
Subject: [CP] apology for mass mailed photo
Dear listserve members.
It appears I messed up and mass mailed a jpg using a auto-mailer program Sat
to all address recorded in my address book, I did stop it before it was
done. I also don't understand how some of the address's were even in my
address book as I have no idea who they are.
Looking at the sent emails from my files the list is too long to write
everyone and explain that this isn't a virus. Judging from the private
response most are list serve members or from my customer data base, I
apologize for this.
I am sorry for this,
Thankfully it wasn't some off-color photo of questionable taste, or the
private business letters I was trying to send out.
I am no computer guru, this is certain. Its just a S. flava picture.
Sincerely,
Michael Hunt
St. Petersburg Florida
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Cp@omnisterra.com)
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 10:12:50 -0500
Subject: [CP] apology for mass mailed photo
Mike,
It's a nice photo, though mine looks to be S. leucophylla with a
caption "Preaching to the Choir", and I got three of them sent to my
work address, lol.
Regards,
Joe Griffin
Lincoln, NE USA
In a message dated 3/10/2003 8:45:06 AM Eastern Standard Time,
stovehouse@earthlink.net writes:
>
>
> Dear listserve members.
>
> It appears I messed up and mass mailed a jpg using a auto-mailer program Sat
> to all address recorded in my address book, I did stop it before it was
> done. I also don't understand how some of the address's were even in my
> address book as I have no idea who they are.
> Looking at the sent emails from my files the list is too long to write
> everyone and explain that this isn't a virus. Judging from the private
> response most are list serve members or from my customer data base, I
> apologize for this.
> I am sorry for this,
>
> Thankfully it wasn't some off-color photo of questionable taste, or the
> private business letters I was trying to send out.
> I am no computer guru, this is certain. Its just a S.
> flava picture.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Michael Hunt
> St. Petersburg Florida
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Cp mailing list
> Cp@omnisterra.com
> http://omnisterra.com/mailman/listinfo/cp_omnisterra.com
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Chris Teichreb)
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 07:45:25 -0800
Subject: [CP] cultivars
Hi Mike,
Oh, I know this topic has been brought up before and I gave my two cents
worth then. While I can understand the rationale for the rules ie: name a
plant before it's widely distributed and starts being called by all sorts of
names, I still think it is a good idea for the ICPS to at least encourage
distribution prior to naming, even if according to the rules the person can
still just go ahead and name it prior to distributing. I don't know, just
makes good common sense to me, at least for cp!
Cheers!
Chris
--
Chris Teichreb
http://www.geocities.com/VCPC2000 (Vancouver Carnivorous Plant Club)
_________________________________________________________________
Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*.
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Cp@omnisterra.com)
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 11:52:45 -0500
Subject: [CP] S. flava on Snake Wranglers"
Hi All,
There is a show on the National Geographic channel called "Snake
Wranglers", that features various specialists catching snakes for
research or whatnot. Anyway, the one a few days ago was about Eastern
Diamback rattlesnakes surviving in Florida, and they showed three
scenes of the guy catching them in long-leaf pine areas and you could
see beautiful gold-green S. flava standing next to him and across the
grassy meadows he was in. Only a plant geek could notice something
like that in a quickly shown scene.
Regards,
Joe Griffin
Lincoln, NE USA
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (kinyon)
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 10:11:59 -0800
Subject: [CP] rolling stone
Hey folks,
A small question for you bryophyte/CP gurus.
I know sphagnum is the moss du jour for cp's, but why exactly is green moss
bad news for carnivorous plants? How does it kill them?
Joseph Kinyon
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Cp@omnisterra.com)
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 13:21:09 -0500
Subject: [CP] rolling stone
Joseph,
I am not 100% sure, but I think the green moss is a moss that is dried
and then dyed green, and therefore toxic to the more sensitive CP. It
is used for decorative uses.I hope someone will correct me on that, if I
am wrong.
Regards,
Joe Griffin
Lincoln, NE USA
n a message dated 3/10/2003 1:11:59 PM Eastern Standard Time,
kinyon@sbcglobal.net writes:
>
>
> Hey folks,
>
>
> A small question for you bryophyte/CP gurus.
>
>
> I know sphagnum is the moss du jour for cp's, but why
> exactly is green moss
>
> bad news for carnivorous plants? How does it kill them?
>
>
>
> Joseph Kinyon
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Cp mailing list
> Cp@omnisterra.com
> http://omnisterra.com/mailman/listinfo/cp_omnisterra.com
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Steve LaWarre)
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 13:45:31 -0500
Subject: [CP] rolling stone
You are absolutely right Joe, and as an added note: Most of the "green =
Moss" that you can buy for decorative purposes is striped from logs as =
they are processed for lumber. These terrestrial mosses do not have the =
same pH properties or the water holding capacity that LF sphagnum does. =
In my experience, this type of moss product just gets rotten and stinky =
when kept wet.
Steve LaWarre
Grand Rapids MI
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Killerplants@aol.com [mailto:Killerplants@aol.com]
> Sent: Monday, March 10, 2003 1:21 PM
> To: Cp@omnisterra.com
> Subject: Re: [CP] rolling stone
>=20
>=20
> Joseph,
>=20
> I am not 100% sure, but I think the green moss is a moss that=20
> is dried and then dyed green, and therefore toxic to the more=20
> sensitive CP. It is used for decorative uses.I hope someone=20
> will correct me on that, if I am wrong.
>=20
> Regards,
>=20
> Joe Griffin
> Lincoln, NE USA
>=20
> n a message dated 3/10/2003 1:11:59 PM Eastern Standard Time,=20
> kinyon@sbcglobal.net writes:
>=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > Hey folks,
> >=20
> >=20
> > A small question for you bryophyte/CP gurus.
> >=20
> >=20
> > I know sphagnum is the moss du jour for cp's, but why=20
> > exactly is green moss
> >=20
> > bad news for carnivorous plants? How does it kill them?
> >=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > Joseph Kinyon
> >=20
> >=20
> > _______________________________________________
> > Cp mailing list
> > Cp@omnisterra.com
> > http://omnisterra.com/mailman/listinfo/cp_omnisterra.com=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Cp mailing list
> Cp@omnisterra.com
> http://omnisterra.com/mailman/listinfo/cp_omnisterra.com
>=20
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (kinyon)
Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 18:59:36 -0800
Subject: [CP] mime mania
Sorry about the recent postings with html.
Even though Outlook is checked to send as plain text only, its sending
messages as html.
That will teach me to ever upgrade again.
Nice blocking script Rick :)
Joseph Kinyon
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Philippe NAMOUR)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 07:44:09 +0100
Subject: [CP] pocosin and carolina bay ?
Hi all
Could a person explain me the difference between a pocosin and a carolina bay?
It's the same thing?
Thanks
Philippe
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com ({USER_FIRSTNAME} {USER_LASTNAME})
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 06:27:17 -0500
Subject: [CP] pocosin and carolina bay ?
its the same thing, only a different word.
Pocosin is a word Native American's called the Carolina Bay. Pocosin means
a swamp on a hill.
Mike
St. Petersburg Florida
----- Original Message -----
To:
Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2003 1:44 AM
>
> Hi all
>
> Could a person explain me the difference between a pocosin and a carolina
bay?
> It's the same thing?
> Thanks
>
>
> Philippe
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Cp mailing list
> Cp@omnisterra.com
> http://omnisterra.com/mailman/listinfo/cp_omnisterra.com
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Jan Schlauer)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 12:36:48 +0100
Subject: [CP] vft cultivars
Dear Chris,
> Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the ICPS encouraged
> distribution of a plant among growers prior to naming it as a cultivar.
While it is favourable that a certain stock of plants is available
before a cultivar enters the trade and before it is named, it is by no
way necessary (and *NOT* recommended by the ICPS!) to distribute any
plants prior to naming.
> By doing this, it ensures it is in cultivation and others deem it
> worthy.
The latter criterion is of great importance to the cp growing community
but it does not have anything to do with cultivar naming or the duties
of the ICPS or other ICRAs.
> This avoids having all of these cultivar names for plants that
> were never properly distributed, or just plain unworthy of cultivar
> status in the opinion of the general cp community.
The opinion of the general cp community can and should be expressed by
awards of merit. This does not affect the naming of cultivars and is not
governed by ICRAs. Awards (and patents or trademarks) are *mentioned* in
the Register of cultivar names but they are not (and must not be)
*granted* by the Registration Authority.
> I can see why naming prior to distribution is preferred, as it avoid
> the confusion between nicknames and true cultivar names. However, I
> look through the list of recently named cultivars and rarely see half of
> them on sellers or traders lists.
This will probably never change (and this was never different in the
past). The International Register lists *all* cultivars for which names
have been established world-wide according to the rules. No nursery on
earth could even hope to gather (and propagate!) a significant fraction
of these. As cultivar names are being registered without regard to
provenience or merit of the corresponding plants, it is highly unlikely
any trade list would ever contain more than a few of these new names.
There are some nurseries that list names of plants they do not actually
have on stock in order to present "complete" listings of cultivars. But
responsible growers should rather refer tp the International Register
because only registration with the ICRA warrants a required minimum of
information on the cultivars to be available.
> Is there a way for a grower to secure a the right to describe a
> particular cultivar without actually registering it until they have
> distributed it?
No. This would encourage and facilitate the distribution of ill-defined,
nicknamed plant material through the horticultural trade. It is one of
the purposes of registration to prevent exactly this
> That way, as stated above, it would ensure it was
> secure in cultivation
"Secure in cultivation" is not a very well defined term. How many
growers do need to have a plant for which period of time until the plant
could be considered "secure in cultivation"? Irrespective of the answer
to this question it would be far too many growers for far too long a
time to avoid bogus name formation and distribution.
> and deemed worthy by others of cultivar status.
Anything on this planet is "of cultivar status" as long as a cultivar
name has been established for it properly. For cultivar status it is
entirely immaterial what "others deem worthy" or not. Others may and
should grant awards of merit, but they are not entitled to judge
cultivar status, which is exclusively defined by the ICNCP.
Kind regards
Jan
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Jan Schlauer)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 12:43:26 +0100
Subject: [CP] Re: Cultivar Publication
Dear William,
> I was wondering if the publication of cultivar status is restricted to
> the printed media (I assume it is). Wouldn't it be wonderful if the
> publication could happen in a faster fashion than allowed by
> conventional printed publication?
The problem of non-printed media is permanence. We have witnessed what
has happened to the cp database (which contains the International
Register of names of cultivated cps), and it could happen again. Even if
the site was mirrored, major damage to a limited number of servers could
cause the data to be inaccessible for a not predictable period of time.
Printed media are distributed and published in a rather more
irreversible way than electronical media. Although it is possible that a
number of libraries will burn down at the same time, It is unlikely that
*all* copies of CPN will vanish from the surface of this planet as long
as some cp freaks will survive.
> Perhaps a future consideration might be the establishment of a dedicated
> web site to host photos and information regarding these cultivars - with
> stipulation that the approved entries be backed up in a hard copy, and
> placed appropriately in predetermined botanical libraries.
Both is effected already by registration of cultivar names by the ICPS
and by publishing the Register with the cp database.
> If the information was burned to CD,
I think this will be sensible once we will have a sufficient number of
standard photographs in electronical format. Work in this direction is
in progress.
> If the only restriction to
> this concept is the question "who will do it", I believe that there are
> willing members of our community who will make this effort for the good
> of all.
Registration is effected already by the ICPS (the International Cultivar
Registration Authority for cps). All we need is people who establish
cultivar names (by publishing appropriate descriptions) and who register
them with the ICPS.
> I think part of the reason no one registers these plants as
> cultivars is the paucity of acceptable journals for cultivar
> publication.
Well, a good proportion of recently bred cultivars has been described
already, and the names have been registered (as published in CPN).
> The ICPN could not handle a serious and concerted effort
> to legitimize these common (but bogus) assignations by the CP community,
> even if all were willing to fully embrace the concept.
We are very well prepared to handle all such efforts (by those who
accept the concept) so far. Bogus naming will probably not vanish but I
think the number of people who prefer bogus to registration is
decreasing. I will continue my efforts to sustain this trend.
> The CPN backlog would stretch for years!
Only in theory. Much of the bogus-named stuff is not well defined (so it
will very probably never be described) and clearly defined cultivars can
be described very easily (so the descriptions will not require much
space in CPN). Calls for descriptions (we have published several ones in
the past already) have never yielded unsurmountable amounts of useful
submissions.
So far our capacities in CPN are sufficient to satisfy all demands
for cultivar descriptions.
> I picture my proposal as working like this: If someone wanted to publish
> a cultivar they would write the description, attach the requisite
> photo(s) and email these to you. You would then assess the entry, and
> if acceptable after appropriate review, forward the file with your
> approval to the
(change text from here)
> webmaster who then 1) enters it on the site (which entry
> carries a time/date stamp) and 2) backs it immediately to hard copy
> (stored in a couple of different places).
new text: co-editor (Barry) who then submits the text to Steve for
layout. The date (of receipt) is added as soon as the manuscript is
received from the author, and published together with the description in
CPN. As soon as the description is published effectively (i.e. the
printed matter is available to the general public), the name is
established, and the name, details on its publication, description,
standard, etc. are added to the International Register together with the
date of registration.
> Please consider and forward this concept, if you feel it has merit, to
> anyone with the capacity to make decisions regarding this protocol.
We are already using a very similar protocol with the important
difference that we are applying a form of publication that conforms with
the ICNCP.
If you would like to change the text of the ICNCP to include the
possibility of internet publication, please contact Piers Trehane who is
collecting proposals to change the Code.
> I
> feel that with a speedier and more accessible vehicle of acceptable
> publication, many of these plants at last could have the legitimate name
> they deserve and are commonly referred to by,
The name they are referred to by is not legitimate in the case of bogus
names.
> and we could begin
> intelligent discussion about what we grow, and what we think we grow.
Publishing the description is not at all the bottleneck. Most cultivar
descriptions have been published within 1.5 years after submission,
while many bogus names have been around for several decades.
> The internet is a powerful tool of communication, I hope we can utilize
> it to help bring intelligent resolution to the guessing game of "who has
> which what".
Printed publication and registration are the tools proposed by the ICNCP
to achieve this goal. The ICPS is using the internet where appropriate
and possible in this context.
Kind regards
Jan
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Jan Schlauer)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 12:43:38 +0100
Subject: [CP] CPN format & contents
Dear Ivan,
(RE: _Drosera_ nomenclature)
> I would be happy to contribute such an article for CPN. It is sure
> to receive a compromising annotation in the form of a biased and even
> hostile editorial comment.
It would depend on the manuscript. I doubt, however, there would be any
comment if it respected the ICBN appropriately.
The important point is it would probably be published in CPN.
Kind regards
Jan
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Jan Schlauer)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 12:58:20 +0100
Subject: [CP] CPN format & contents
Dear Michael,
> Most likely though I would deny it and try my best to be fair the CPN at
> that point would lean towards cultural content over more scientific
> genetic/lab work and nomenclature.
I am not sure I understand what you mean here. What would you
like to achieve and how?
> All publications are swayed by the Editorial content and
> remembered that way.
> For instance the Washington Post Newspaper or New York Times may
report the
> news but both are known for leaning a certain direction editorially.
This sounds like the old censorship debate but I know you don't mean
this (because of your disclaimer). So what do you want to say here?
> Jan you honestly don't feel in the not to distant future that
interest could
> grow with using the web for publication?
This interest does no doubt exist. But so far I do not see how CPN could
satisfy such a demand. There are others who are much more qualified to
act here than CPN. Judging from my own workload with editing CPN, I do
neither feel the necessity nor do I see the possibility to spend even
more of my non-paid, volunteer, leisure time on ICPS publications.
Furthermore I am probably not sufficiently trained to process materials
for an online journal with the circulation and content you indicated. So
the product you mentioned would quite radically differ from CPN, and it
would not be justified to give it the same name.
> The example of the official ICPS
> site is excellent, professionally done, interesting, & maintained.
It is
> building nicely with expanding information. Worth a look and then
another
> look on a regular basis to see what's new.
This seems to indicate the direction we should go. So actually it is not
CPN we are talking about.
> More trade and professional
> publications are being made available as paid subscriptions on-line in
> various formats. The information can be expanded, is more timely, and
> allows for more photo opportunity over a costly printed format. I would
> think, it could streamline the help & labor needed to publish a printed
> Journal.
Yes, indeed.
> In the future I predict that many more periodicals will be only
available
> through the web as printing, labor, & postage continue to rise.
Formats for
> copying the on-line publications such as pdf will become more used
by the
> home computer for producing hard copies.
This is probably true, and we are thinking about releasing back issues
of CPN this way. But this is still a significant distance from an online
journal appearing every other month.
> Jan you are a very irritable sounding type of guy
There are some itchy spots, indeed. So far I have, however, always tried
to mention reasons together with my opinion.
> and your sarcasm was noted in your demeaning reply to me.
My reply was not meant to be demeaning (while some sarcasm was indeed
involved). I wanted to make clear exactly what I do not consider
constructive or feasible suggestions in the context of CPN.
> But maybe that was because you thought I was attacking the way
articles are
> submitted and published
I thought you wrote:
"CPN is about the same size, less content as the format started with in
1979. Far less cultural content......"
Please correct me if I am wrong.
> which is personal
Well, being one of the people responsible for editing the stuff that
appears in CPN, I tend to interpret statements like the above as personal.
> and I wasn't making comments regarding this past issue.
OK, I see. But in this case, you should not have talked about CPN, which
is quite a different pair of socks.
> If I can submit something of use to the CPN I will. Barry contacted
me man
> months ago regarding co-writing a article with Doug Darnowski. I would
> gladly write something, but in this case I didn't have the expertise
needed
> to pull my end of the article so I declined. The article Barry
suggested is
> excellent and would be extremely interesting to most readers of the
CPN and
> I hope it will be completed.
Who should do this if not you? We do not only need the people who would
read these papers. Someone must write them. There is really no alternative.
> Further I am writing a article for future submission which is dreadfully
> needed this is on treating fungal disease on the plants.
Very good.
> I suggest a regular Genus/species/cultivar column in every CPN,
though done
> in the past cultural data changes and even repeated information would be
> welcomed. I will write on what I have long term experience growing.
Very good.
> Give me a list I will contact growers and ask them if they would be
> interested in being a special guest writer regarding a special plant
they
> grow well.
Hans Luhrs, Thomas Carow, Stan Lampard, Eric Partrat, Eric Green, Peter
D'Amato, Bruce Lee Bednar.
Some of these gentlemen have already promised to submit articles to CPN.
We are waiting...
> We can do some short human interest feature as well as plants on
> the members of the ICPS
Yes, indeed, if appropriate manuscripts were submitted.
> - Hello Fernando in Brazil we would like to write a article on your
> experience and a biography regarding your cp travels (human interest)
Fernando is one of our most prolific regular correspondents and we will
continue to publish his papers. I do not think you need to give him a
starter.
> - Hello Ivan Snyder how about a article for the June 2008 CPN
regarding your
> interest with nomenclature of Drosera?
This is in press and will very likely be published earlier.
> .... yes I can do this, sign me up! I volunteer today.
What do you need to be signed up for? Just do it!
> Please don't be such a meanie,
This listserve would be half the fun without a personal reply
or two.
Anyway, sorry if I offended you. This was not my intention.
Kind regards
Jan
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Chris Teichreb)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 07:56:00 -0800
Subject: [CP] vft cultivars
Dear Jan,
While you may be a big meanie, I thank you for your thorough response to
my questions and previous e-mails. I realize as far as registering
cultivars, you have to follow the rules. However, I still think that people
should be encouraged to distribute the cultivar in order to maintain it in
cultivation and so that it can be appreciated by others.
Anyway, this has been hashed over in previous postings, so I won't
continue on. My views are as a cp grower and what I would like to see as a
cp grower, not necessarily following the rules.
On an interesting note for other cp growers, according to the rules,
cultivar descriptions can be published in something as simple as your local
cp club's newsletter (correct me if I'm wrong on this Jan). So, if you
think that it will take too long to print in CPN, this is an option.
Personally (again, personal opinion!), I would much rather publish a
cultivar description in CPN as this reaches a wider audience and is a much
better publication then most local club newsletters.
Cheers!
Chris
--
Chris Teichreb
http://www.geocities.com/VCPC2000 (Vancouver Carnivorous Plant Club)
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From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Philippe NAMOUR)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 19:21:06 +0100
Subject: [CP] pocosin and carolina bay ?
A 06:27 11/03/03 -0500, {USER_FIRSTNAME} {USER_LASTNAME} a =E9crit :
>its the same thing, only a different word.
>
>Pocosin is a word Native American's called the Carolina Bay. Pocosin=
means
>a swamp on a hill.
Humm ! Mike
I have some doubts !
In this paragraph from US FS, it is written:
"Long Lake is a blackwater Carolina Bay Lake located in the Croatan=20
National Forest. Previously owned by the United States Forest Service and=
=20
now under private ownership, Long Lake is a large but shallow body with an=
=20
average depth of one meter and a maximum depth of two meters. The lake is=
=20
surrounded by and undisturbed pocosin swamp and managed forestland."
One possible explanation would be that carolina bay is an acidic open water=
=20
and pocosin a vegetalized peat bog ??
But I do not know any more for the moment
Philippe
Lyon, France
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Chris Teichreb)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 10:56:34 -0800
Subject: [CP] pocosin and carolina bay ?
Philippe,
>Humm ! Mike
>
>I have some doubts !
>In this paragraph from US FS, it is written:
>"Long Lake is a blackwater Carolina Bay Lake located in the Croatan
>National Forest. Previously owned by the United States Forest Service and
>now under private ownership, Long Lake is a large but shallow body with an
>average depth of one meter and a maximum depth of two meters. The lake is
>surrounded by and undisturbed pocosin swamp and managed forestland."
>
Sounds like Carolina Bay is the name of the area and pocosin is a habitat
type. Looking up pocosin, I got this definition from Webster's dictionary:
Etymology: probably from Virginia or North Carolina Algonquian
Definition: an upland swamp of the coastal plain of the southeastern U.S.
Hope that helps!
Chris
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From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Trent Meeks)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 20:40:58 +0000
Subject: [CP] N. Coccinea upper traps
Hi Everyone,
Someone asked a few days ago if anyone has ever seen upper pitchers on N.
Coccinea. Yes, I have, and yes, I have photos of them. They are elongated
versions of the lowers and display all the features typical of this type of
hybrid: reduced wings, not as dark in color-more spotted than solid. Usually
the vine slows down once the ground shoots appear, but this one plant I
staked up straight, and it grew over four feet, producing a set of large
aerial traps.
Hope this was helpful.
Until later,
Trent Meeks
Boca Raton, Florida
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From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Mark Todd)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 16:19:03 -0500
Subject: [CP] Carolina Bays and pocosin
Carolina Bays are located in Southeastern North Carolina on the costal
plain. Don Schnell called the Carolina Bays mysterious structures. Here's
how he described them in his book.
"Supposedly named because they often contain multiple species of evergreen
shrubs that are collectively called bays, these are shallow oval depressions
with the ovals uniformly aligned northwest to southeast.The Carolina Bays
are best appreciated from the air.They are surrounded by slightly raised
ridges of sand, which are most pronounced on the southeast borders.The
Carolina Bays vary in size from a few meters to several square kilometers.
Several are filled with water and are the few natural lakes in the costal
plains. Most are filled with peat and have a nearly impenetrable dense
growth of broadleaf ericaceous evergreen shrubs. Carnivorous plants may be
found at the margins of the bays, where there are some clearing
The origin of the Carolina Bays is far from decided. There are many
theories, including everything from takeoff locations for ancient alien
spacecrafts to depressions left by whales swishing their tales when the
ocean covered the area. The most likely theory seems to be that the bays are
the result of meteor showers some 50,000 years ago. There do not seem to be
foreign rock traces, but meteors could have been dirty ice, as so many seem
to be. Savage (1982)wrote an exhaustive and readable study or the possible
origins of these depressions."
Here's link where you can see the Carolina Bays from the air:
http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?size=big&mapdata=IFf9QlHFUAgTMBROkRlSrsZweRMcQ%2f0OM0Kh%2bjqTqR2R0hDzD86LpbZ7%2byI6MxSJJFVN2u2P83ZCynZwwW%2f%2bW4M3%2bf4XDCrJykqCDk0dpAM4169%2fXJBpMl8%2fVcCvHWccl2YWpQab%2f4DXsBsLHOcyy9pXisdHMV4X87Ocu4k%2bXo2lxHJI%2f1PL%2bJQm4sP3rxpZ7Lu1WfZ%2bviXqbmvDjs7dtncW2rUi33rMcdXhQ3rwUdq6E1oL%2brNmcx9Vs74GgsawjspC1OX8BYQKrm5KQpNuQxQJ22MFuJ0GD%2bWJ4IGfM4o%3d
In this pic you can see some of the larger Carolina Bays. Notice the larger
dark lake, that is Lake Waccamaw, the largest of the bays. If you look
directly north you will see a series of lakes called the Bladen lakes.
Here's a closer look at those:
http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?mapdata=IFf9QlHFUAj%252bUbuNEiEknaxuO4udrozOZyKjY8SW8YGMCjWxTkNULhjzFeEHKiPr2JfbcBepF7Cma3z6uANTA2IvSlR2DBNkM%252bviRBE3Bj3RgFOol7IM9gab6Jj8tTT4P3nCes1LJJ0kdaVgGB27ojpfJJxBTdbVszYgc9CgqSNbShVlVWvKqrh4T7C%252bHztgDn86Nf4LOt4aQrStHxHzz0cFNzUI6O5OQ4O0txwE4PviRhUpxbJImIP3k2%252fzOvikqPUUUdgycHJwBm3DfemvEf92sm9dBEADwoOwC8AWylg%253d&click=zoom&mqmap.x=264&mqmap.y=255
You can zoom in on any of these for a closer look
I know the Carolina Bays very well that is where I was born and spent most
of my life.
Pocosins are shrub bogs. I don't know much about them but from what I know
they are bogs that are located in savannas. If I'm wrong about Pocosins I'm
sure somebody here will point it out to me.
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From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Cp@omnisterra.com)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 16:31:30 -0500
Subject: [CP] Carolina Bay vs. Pocosin
Phillippe --
Here is my understanding of the difference between the two terms. I am
not certain that my understanding is accurate, but it fits with my own
observations and relevant literature (Wildflowers of South Carolina, and
other non CP-specific texts).
Carolina Bays are depressions certainly, but not all are filled with
water. I have seen many Bays of varying sizes that are quite dry.
Others -- as you have correctly pointed out -- do fill with water. My
understanding of poquosin habitat is that it is transitional between
Bays (which tend to be open and often savannah-like in nature) and
higher and drier terrain. Dionaea muscipula appears to favor this
transitional habitat, which begins on the ridges of land surrounding the
lower Bays.
I hope this helps.
Jay Lechtman
Virginia, USA
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (David P Banks)
Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2003 09:26:20 +1100
Subject: [CP] Grant Young
As some of you already know, it is with deep regret to advise friends that
Grant Young passed away yesterday evening (Monday) aged just 44.
He died at home after suffering a sudden heart attack. Grant was the finest
grower of Nepenthes I have seen and had a vast and diverse collection of
quality carnivorous plants and orchids.
His partner, Gowan, has asked me to let you know that Grant's funeral
service will be held this Thursday at:
North Shore Temple Emmanuel {Jewish} 28 Chatswood Ave. (off Victoria
Road) Chatswood NSW Australia Thursday 13th March 2003 at 12 Noon.
All of Grant & Gowan's friends are invited.
********************************************
David P. Banks
Hills District Orchids
39 Carole Street,
Seven Hills NSW 2147 Australia
Phone (02) 9674-4720 Fax (02) 9686-3303
Editor "Australian Orchid Review"
###################
From: Cp@omnisterra.com (Barry A. Rice)
Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 15:22:40 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [CP] Encouraging CPN submissions
Hey Guys,
Just a quick hello (when I should be working on these dang powerpoint
presentations).
I certainly welcome anyone's efforts at encouraging CPN submissions.
Thanks for the help. I do this myself, whenever I see something
interesting. Unfortunately, I think I've realized about a 5% success rate
in this---lots of people say they'd be happy to write articles, but hardly
anyone ever comes through on the pledges.
However, if you folks are doing something cool, write it up! If you know
of something cool happening, write it up! If you know of a buddy who is
doing something cool, encourage them to write it up!
I would also